My Money is safe in the Bank. Of course, sure it’s as safe as houses ! Eh, sorry ?
I have been asked to comment on the relationship between Customer and Banker. This arose from several conversations on Twitter where I have been criticised for attacking the morality, or lack thereof, of the Banks and their use of customers monies. I have been asked to point out the crimes which the Bankers have committed. I have struggled with this issue. I am not a Criminal Lawyer, my expertise being in Personal Injuries, Divorce and Real Estate Law. I personally believe that our Government, among others have subjugated the rights of the Citizen to those of the wealthy Elites and their Bankers. In paying off Bondholders, believed to be other Bankers and their kin, the Irish Government have decimated our economy resulting is terrible austerity imposed upon our Citizens. There is something wrong here. People are being ripped off, no other way to put it, by Bankers, now referred to as Banksters, because that is what they are, gangsters who have used the money deposited with them in whatever manner they so wish. They gamble with your money. Now, the Citizen is continually bailing out these same Banks. Our Government has chosen to stand firmly on the side of these banksters against the interests of the Citizen.
OK, so what is the legal position in all this. Sure isn’t our own money safe in the Bank ? Well, not really. Because once you hand your hard-earned money across the counter to the Bank, it is their money, not yours. The relationship is best described in a case brought before the English House of Lords (their highest Appeals Court) in the case of Foley v Hill. The Appellant in 1829 opened a bank account with the respondents, who were bankers. Further deposits were added in
1830 and in 1831 interest was still added. In 1838 the Appellant brought proceedings against the Respondent Bankers seeking recovery of both the principle and interest.
In his Judgment the Lord Chancellor Cottenham said…
” Money, when paid into a bank, ceases altogether to be the money of the principal; it is by then the money of the banker, who is bound to return an equivalent by paying a similar sum to that deposited with him when he is asked for it. The money paid into a banker’s is money known by the principal to be placed there for the purpose of being under the control of the banker; it is then the banker’s money; he is known to deal with it as his own; he makes what profit of it he can, which profit he retains to himself, paying back only the principal, according to the custom of bankers in some places, or the principal and a small rate of interest, according to the custom of bankers in other places. The money placed in custody of a banker is, to all intents and purposes, the money of the banker, to do with it as he pleases; he is guilty of no breach of trust in employing it; he is not answerable to the principal if he puts it into jeopardy, if he engages in a hazardous speculation; he is not bound to keep it or deal with it as the property of his principal; but he is, of course, answerable for the amount, because he has contracted, having received that money, to repay to the principal, when demanded, a sum equivalent to that paid into his hands.
That has been the subject of discussion in various cases, and that has been established to be the relative situation of banker and customer. That being established to be the relative situations of banker and customer, the banker is not an agent or factor, but he is a debtor. ”
So legally, when you deposit your money in a Bank, the Bank becomes the legal owner of your money and you become a Creditor of the Bank. In the event of the Bank becoming insolvent you take your place at the end of the queue after Secured Creditors. Should any monies be left after such payments have been made you will most likely receive maybe a cent in the Euro…if you’re lucky.
Surely the Government will secure my money for me? What about the Bank Guarantee? Well, in Ireland the State at present, will guarantee your money up to the tune of Euro 100,000. No doubt they can change this on a whim. As can be seen from the attempted confiscation of money from people’s accounts in Cyprus recently, any funds over 100,000 could be lost. Don’t be fooled by the amount of the guarantee. In many cases Citizens have received compensation for their injuries and have deposited the money in Banks to look after their disability for the many years to come. Some old people have saved up their whole lives so they would not be a burden on their families. People sell their homes and place the funds in a Bank while searching for somewhere else. In business, transactions take place where funds are obtained to secure a deal, purchase items etc. At any time those funds are not regarded as yours by the Bank but are being used by the Bank as they please. As we’ve seen so many times, The Banks are treated as too Big to Fail and as a result our National Sovereignty has been lost and it seems we are eternally indebted to them. Of course when Debt Forgiveness is mentioned for the Citizen this is dismissed out of hand. Divide and Conquer is deployed as a tactic. Sure I paid off my debt so why can’t he? Please, wake up before we’re all securely lodged in a debtors prison with no means of escape.
LegaleagleStar , Tuesday , 4th. June , 2013
Foley v Hill and Others , 1848 , Clerk’s Reports, House of Lords 1847-66 Pages 28 and Pages 36-37.
Ireland in Ruins
English: Anglo Irish Bank, Great Victoria Street, Belfast, Northern Ireland, October 2010 (Photo credit: Wikipedia)
During the week I Retweeted the following from KSat News in San Antonio, Texas….
I wonder how many of these guys made money from Irish Citizens? Bondholders ? Ask #Enda World’s richest billionaires http://www.ksat.com/-/478556/9259712/-/wvv8urz/-/index.html#.UTT3ocxeiUo.twitter …
If we go to the List we see Warren Buffett, the 82-year-old CEO of Berkshire Hathaway is worth an estimated $53.5 billion. Bill Gates, chairman and co-founder of Microsoft Corp., is also co-chairman of the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. His net worth is more than $67 billion. I ask the hypothetical question whether any of these made money on the back of the Irish Citizen? The answer is that I don’t know and our Government is making sure that I cannot find the answer as they refuse to disclose the identity of the Bondholders of Anglo Irish Bank and other Bank Bondholders who have been handed money by our Tax Payers. Our Government has, and is paying back every cent due to these same anonymous bondholders. The Citizen on the other hand, those that invested their redundancy or inheritances, if they were lucky enough to have the money in the first place, have taken huge loses in whatever Funds they were advised to invest in. No bailout for the Citizen, only those who claim Elite status.
The Citizen in Ireland now faces a life devoid of hope. They face the serious prospect of their homes being repossessed by these same Banks and Financial Institutions who they have in fact bailed out. My point is that Billionaires small change would rescue Ireland. But our Government prefers to be the Good Boy in the Euro Class and instead bleed their citizens dry. I’m sure that Billionaires have reaped the rewards from their Bonds, many of which were purchased, I’m told, at a great markdown. I’m sure they were laughing at the incompetent Irish all the way to their banks.
We’re told we are in a recession. I’m not an economist but have listened carefully to our Economists over the past number of years. Their diverse opinions are at times illuminating but it seems most just base their opinions and comments on what is in the media at any given time. Some, who I believe should know better give us little hope and just side with Government strategy in advising more austerity and pain for Citizens who already have been cut to the bone. It seems they reside in a parallel universe where people count for little or nothing and all that is important is the survival of the multinational conglomerates and their bankers. Tune in to Vincent Browne’s Show Monday to Thursday at 11pm on TV3 and listen to their endless diatribe. To be fair to Vincent he does tend to show them up for what they are and in an entertaining fashion.
Historically, Irish People have trusted their politicians and for that matter, their local friendly bank manager. If advised to purchase a home they will follow the advice, take whatever mortgage is offered and complete the purchase. They are fed media hype concerning what they should buy and most if not all media handed out advise on a weekly basis with glossy inserts in the daily papers. People are trusting and believe what they are told. Naive many would say, but I for one have seen what motivates people. As a solicitor in practise for over thirty years, I see the ‘little guy’ spending his/her hard-earned cash in ways that they are ‘urged’ to do by their ‘leaders’, whether politicians, bank managers, investment brokers, Thursday’s Irish Independent Property Supplement, Friday’s Irish Times Property Supplement or indeed the Sunday Papers with their advice regarding the queues outside housing developments to get a bargain. People cannot be expected to discriminate against such pressure from those they have come to trust. Their Friday Irish Times has in fact become the ‘Bible’ for such people. Can we honestly blame people for being taken in by such propaganda? The media, our politicians etc. were forcing an agenda. Those behind the newspapers, advisers and yes sadly, our politicians were making a fortune for themselves, I believe, on the back of the citizen. The money our people spent ended up in already rich coffers.
Now politicians change their mind and continue our previous Government’s austerity measures. People threw out Fianna Fail as they believed them corrupt and voted for change. Now they feel betrayed by those they trusted, again naively some might say, who now claim their hands are tied by previous the Government. So while politicians change their minds and continue to trade cheap shots with one another, the Citizen is driven to bankruptcy, lose their family homes and family silver and are told its their own fault. ‘We partied during the Celtic Tiger’ we have been told. No we didn’t. Yes, most did their part as they were told and spent money on property, if the funds were handed to them. To say people partied is an insult. The Citizen is now driven to despair and sadly many lives have been lost due primarily to the helpless situation they find themselves in. Families have been broken up, many, too many suicides have occurred and yet the Government ignores their pleas for help.
Yesterday we saw our leaders Enda Kenny, Fine Gael and Eamonn Gilmore, Labour Party ‘glorify’ in the success of the first two years of their Government. They told us that we are doing well. The reality is somewhat different on the streets where the level of poverty has arisen to greater heights than ever before in my lifetime. This without the upcoming property tax, water metering and whatever other schemes they dream up to fleece the citizen. Remember all those that bought their homes paid an enormous amount of Stamp Duty and to ask them to now pay Property Tax is an absolute travesty of justice. Those ‘economists’ who favour this charge citing other countries property taxes, simply ignore this injustice. Shame on them ! There seems a major disconnect from what politicians are saying and what the reality is. While citizens are awakening in a new era of poverty and austerity, corporations, who are not even pursued for the meagre corporation tax, continue to prosper. Who are the Government working for? The citizen or the multinationals who continue to prosper?
Are we in a recession or is it the implementation of all those Euro Treaties that we were told would bring jobs, prosperity etc. The United States of Europe, which no Irish Citizen ever voted openly for, but is the culmination of said Treaties, is now a reality and its imposition is being forced upon us. Be careful for what you wish for as all those Yes to Europe Votes have indeed come back to haunt us. We Irish are now a small poor Statelet within a huge capitalist entity. How did we ever think we’d be a player enjoying equality and fraternity with the likes of Germany? That is what we were sold by our politicians and we believed them. Recently on RTE Pat Rabbitte, a prominent member of the Labour Party said that you say some things before elections. He was justifying a change of mind when parties take power…
Video: Pat Rabbitte admits to breaking election promises http://www.joe.ie/news-politics/current-affairs/video-pat-rabbitte-admits-to-breaking-election-promises-0031538-1 … via @JOEdotie …And We continue to believe them..
Enda Kenny changed his mind on taxing the family home. I tweeted on this…Tom Baldwin @LegalEagleStar
‘It is morally wrong. unjust+unfair to tax a person’s home.’ EndaKenny 1994.’Don’t ever trust a politician.’ Me, 2013 pic.twitter.com/0P05G6vxY1
When I was in College we were taught about Capitalism, that you were ‘Never too big to fail’ What utter nonsense. Whosoever controls the capital calls the tune. Billionaires who continue to prosper, their bankers and suchlike, many under the guise of Anglo Irish bank Bondholders control this new United States of Europe. I wonder as to where the old Nazis are now because Hitler has indeed realised his ultimate goal of a United States of Europe under German control and with an ‘Elite’ firmly in charge of our destiny. Whatever will the German people think when they discover what is really happening to the Irish Citizen?
LegalEagleStar , Thursday , 7th. March , 2013.
Why become a Lawyer…sure aren’t they only money grabbing Scum !
As a teenager, I was an enthusiastic fan of Perry Mason. I was blown away by his expertise. That man could save people accused and looking guilty. Of course they were innocent but it was only his expertise that exposed the truth. What a Guy. It would appear that Perry was an inspiration for a generation of lawyers. Later ‘idols’ included Ally McBeal, the lawyers at LA Law and more recently Denny Crane and Alan Shore, not to mention Shirley Schmidt, all at Boston Legal. What all of these idols represented was a pursuit of justice for their clients both rich and poor.
During my College years in the mid to late 1970′s, I encountered a very diverse set of fellow students. There was the middle-aged teacher who felt that ‘it was time for a change’. He was a very genuine guy and told all that would listen to him, that his days teaching had come to an end and that he needed a new challenge. There was the Canadian businessman who wanted to come back to Ireland and felt that he wanted to pursue a career in law. My friend Anna was about my age, late teens, and had always wanted to be a solicitor. She came from a wealthy background but was a good person who wanted to do some good. Phyllis was a law clerk and had developed an interest in law and felt it was the natural progression, career-wise, to go to College in order to step up the ladder so to speak. Ann, who had numerous degrees already felt it was time, yet again, to go back and this time get a law degree to add to the numerous degrees she already possessed. She took us all under her belt and gave us the guidance we really needed. There was another Anne who was the daughter of a wealthy banker. She was really mature compared to me. She had her career planned out. Daddy had arranged this. She had brains to burn unlike me who felt somewhat overawed in such company. I must say they were a great support and source of encouragement to be during those years. While I was wildly idealistic, I was getting a real education in life itself. We were a diverse group but the one thing that we all had in common was our enthusiasm for the law. Many a debate, some heated, we engaged in and it was where I encountered politics or should I say Political Parties and the hold and influence they had on people. I saw that it was not only what you know but who you knew that seemed to determine your future.
It was during my second year that I got involved with FLAC (Free Legal Advice Centres). I didn’t apply to join them but was so fascinated with a young enthusiastic female barrister,now a Senior Counsel, who literally threw me into the deep end, that I encountered a vast number of people who The System had ignored and needed our help. It was no time before I was in charge of FLAC in Ballymun and had to deal with numerous social based problems and in particular Family Law. What a fantastic group of people I was privileged to meet. They gave of their time and energy to give advice and indeed appear in Court representing people who could not afford to go into a Solicitor for advice. I must mention here that some firms gave of their time and expertise to help us and for that we were so very grateful. Without their help and letting us use their names to front our Court appearances, we would not have had access to the Court system to protect the rights of the most vulnerable and dismissed in our society.
Well, the results were out. We all passed our exams, Thank God. I think my late father’s prayers had more to do with my success than the many hours spent trying to come to grips with the niceties of the law. We all headed our separate ways and ended up in one job or another. Personally I had a workload what with my involvement in FLAC. This followed me into practice as you just couldn’t hand it over to someone in the hope that they would look after the client. These many clients had become personal to me. I set up practice from my father’s house and with the support of my family I commenced to practice. The rest is history. I was lucky in that I was busy from the start. Apart from the numerous Free cases I did, I got work locally and over the first few years I was able to make a living. Most of my Classmates joined established firms and most stayed the course and are still practicing today.
Was making money a motivation? It certainly was for some but I must say the interest in law was the major factor. For most of us making a living was the important factor as this gave us the energy and enthusiasm to pursue issues through the Courts that would make a difference to people’s lives. It was not glamorous standing outside the Family Law Courts attempting to settle cases. The deserted wife with four children attempting to live on £25 a week was not uncommon. The husband who deserted them claiming he wasn’t working, had no money, when the opposite was the case. Those were hard and tough times for these women and they relied on us to give them the chance to survive. While Ann and one or two others may have gone into banking, most of the rest of us dealt with the ordinary citizen and to be honest, I wouldn’t have it any other way.
LegalEagleStar , Wednesday , 23rd. January , 2013 .
End of Days… and Remembering the Poor at Christmas, it just might be You !
According to the Mayan Calendar, tomorrow marks the end of the world. Living in Ireland today we might think that the end of the world, as we know it, is indeed nigh. So, if you are reading this next Saturday, the prophesy is obviously wrong but you never know. Stranger things have happened as my Uncle Bernie used to say.
For many years now I have had the privilege, as a solicitor, to act for some of those we refer to as the poor. I do not make such a reference in any disparaging way but mention it now as it appears to be more meaningful at this time of year and in the Ireland of Christmas 2012. Scripture mentions that the poor will always be with us, but today, more than anytime I can remember, the poor are very close to us. Yes, those living in this depressing country called Ireland. It was not always so. I love my country and condemn those that have abused it for their own selfish needs.
Poverty can be of many varieties. The obvious being those on low and middle incomes who have found it desperately hard to pay their household bills; to feed their children and indeed put clothes on their backs. If it wasn’t for the St. Vincent de Paul Society, The Simon Community and other such charities, many would have lost their homes and literally be on the side of the road. Those that have, will and should dig deep into their pockets in order to help their fellow-man survive this tough winter. We live in unprecedented times when our Government has literally turned their backs on the Irish Citizens in pursuit of a greater European vision of a New Beginning. Unfortunately that vision does not cater for, nor improve the lot of the working man. It is a Europe where Big Business will thrive at the expense of the ordinary citizen.
There is another type of poverty rampant in Ireland today that crosses all class barriers, if indeed you do believe in the class system, which I do not. This is the issue of the mental health of the nation. While you may be lucky enough to be able to pay your bills this winter, you may well be suffering mental illness brought on, in many cases by the disastrous state of the country. Those that brought about this economic decline and indeed those that continue the austerity policies which are drowning the citizens in debt, have a lot to answer for. The number of suicides is unacceptable but seem to be the inevitable consequences of austerity and the policies being imposed by those Elites who continue to pursue their own selfish agenda to the detriment of the citizen. Shame on them and their fellow travellers.
May I wish everyone a Happy and Holy Christmas but ask that you remember those less well off than yourself especially at this time of year. Be as generous as you can and remember to spend time with people. Many times it is the time spent with our fellow-man that brings about the most benefits. If the Mayans have got it right, then maybe our suffering poor can be spared the indignity of yet another harsh winter of discontent.
LegalEagleStar , Thursday 20th. December , 2012.
Childrens Referendum. A Sinister Constitutional Amendment or just another botched job ?
There are several issues or questions which arise when looking to the proposed Referendum on November 10th. Your legal right under Article 42.5 of the Constitution deciding on what is in the “best interest” of the child could now ultimately be decided by the State. The Courts already use this “best interest” test when deciding issues of custody, guardianship and access on a daily basis when parties cannot agree in Family Law proceedings.
Personally, I think that adoption is the biggest issue in the yes/no vote debate. Your child could be placed for adoption against your will. While I do not think this decision would be taken lightly and several steps have to be taken in this regard, it is a scary thought. This can happen in the context of what is the current child care procedure in which a child can be taken off its parents / parent / guardians and into the care of the State. An Interim Care Order is sought firstly and must be renewed every 28 days until the full hearing where it is decided whether a full Care Order is made or not. If a Care Order is made, it is put in place until the child attains 18 years of age. There are times however when parents etc. do apply before that time and a new Hearing occurs. Access can still take place between the parents and the child while the child is under the care of the State. The care system is in dire need of reform with the scary statistics showing the number of children who either die (260), go missing (500) or are ultimately abandoned by the State at the age of 18 years. This gives the State the power to make the child available for adoption once in their care. The Child Care Courts come under the remit of family law and therefore these proceedings are held “in camera” or in private and therefore the parties concerned are not permitted to discuss the matter in public.
There are flaws in the system and reform is needed in that, for example, while unmarried parents can voluntarily place their child up for adoption, there is no provision for a married couple to do so. There are children in long-term State care in which adoption would be appropriate in these cases. However, an argument for the yes vote says that in the past Judges hands were tied, in that they had to be satisfied that there was a high level of failure on the part of the parents and reform would mean a shift to a question of the child’s safety and welfare. I think in lowering any burden or moving the focus to the child is not necessarily the way forward. Independent Cllr Pat Kavanagh said recently to RTE that she is concerned that if the referendum is passed the State might move too early to forcibly remove children from families for adoption. The Wicklow town councillor, who has fostered children and who was a Social Care Worker for 16 years, said fostering costs the State a lot of money and is concerned there is an element of cost-cutting about the proposal. She also went on to state that adoption has ongoing consequences in that children will lose contact, not only with their parents but also with siblings and grandparents, as extended family will have no right of access to an adopted child in the long-term.
In England, in the Baby P case, 2 Doctors were struck off and 4 Social Workers were fired. In Ireland, 260 dead and 500 missing in a decade and nobody has been punished. Baby P, or baby Peter as it was later revealed, was a 17 month old boy who died in London after suffering more than 50 injuries over an eight month period. During this time he was seen several times by Haringey Children’s Services and NHS health professionals. The baby’s name was released on the conclusion of a subsequent trial of Peter’s mother’s boyfriend on a charge of raping a two-year-old. The child’s full identity was revealed when his killers were named after the expiry of a Court Anonymity Order on 10 August 2009.
Another issue that could possibly arise, for example, is that the State could decide that every child should and would be vaccinated and take away the power given to the parent to refuse. That’s not to say this would definitely happen or that these are the intentions of the Government, however, this is an example of the powers the Government could have if such Referendum is passed. Plus what little sovereignty, if any, Ireland still has, could be lost as the UN and EU could make new laws concerning children without the consent of the Irish Government. The United Nations Convention of the Rights of the Child is a legally binding Human Rights Treaty which, if article 42 is changed, will allow unelected people in the EU and UN re-write Irish Law. Like everything else in this country of recent years, it is the loss of the power of the people which is my main concern.
It’s definitely arguable that the UNCRC does not give Irish Children any real new rights which they did not possess before and by giving powers to the State, in fact, removes or takes away children’s rights. While the UNCRC gives rights to children there is no guarantee of these rights. There are developing countries which have ratified the UNCRC and therefore the children have rights to food and water and yet these children are still dying. Some countries also allow for child soldiers, forced marriages to name but a few. At the end of the day the UNCRC does not protect children, their parents, families etc. do.
I believe there should not be a simple Yes or No Vote in the upcoming Referendum but several sections broken down in which you could Vote Yes or No for each. There are flaws and there needs to be change and reform, but bundling it all together in the way it has been proposed, I personally believe is wrong.
LegalEagleStar , 1st. November , 2012 .
‘To those that have more will be given and to those that have not, even that will be taken away.
Today I signed up a new client. She had the misfortune to practically amputate her leg in an accident. The photos of the injury are disturbing to say the least. She had a smile on her face and was very positive. ‘Sure, it probably saved me from something much worse she said.’ I explained the ‘new’ personal injury process; having to go through the Government Personal Injury Assessment Board before we could properly deal with her case. She just said, ‘I’m leaving it in your hands. Just look after me.’
Sitting here now, I’m saddened that my hands are practically tied at this point in time. Yes, we’ll do our work and make sure we get in the evidence but I cannot be but frustrated that our State has imposed such restrictions on me, a professional in the exercise of my professional work. The Government set up this Injury Scheme in the name of the Citizen, to get rid of those greedy lawyers. Nothing could be further from the truth. The fact that I cannot issue a Writ without first going through the State imposed Scheme, is in my opinion, an abuse of power by the State. All Citizens should be entitled to bring their case to Court. It is their right as far as I am concerned.
The Insurance Federation Advertising Campaign again comes to mind. The way they treat the Citizen is nothing short of disgraceful. The inference being that the Irish people are all chancers. That they are out for what they can get. Your neighbour is making money while you all pay up. I suppose it’s nothing more than the way the State is treating it’s citizens now in all aspects of life. Wasn’t it scripture that informed us…. ‘To those that have more will be given and to those that have not, even that will be taken away.’ Well that seems to sum up Ireland in 2012. One law for the rich and another for the ordinary Citizen. Will it ever change?
LegalEagleStar , Tuesday , 9th. October , 2012





